231/231 doubler

[pingpong]

Well I am going to start this post off by telling you why a doubler is cool. By doing a doubler it gives you 3 speeds of 4wd drive, plus 2wd low. Doublers are awesome for rock crawlers(trail rig) and Daily drivers. The advantage for dd's is... you can run a more street friendly gear ratio in your axles, and still have a decent off road t-case ratio. Obviously for crawlers, it works great cause it can give you more control, and traction when needed.

so here we go..

here is a pic of the doubler kit. I bought this off a vendor On Pirate4x. It is a DD machine doubler

http://inlinethumb29.webshots.com/45468/2907974280057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2907974280057109497LAbkPH)

here is a pic of the "range box" and SYE t-case

http://inlinethumb06.webshots.com/47557/2428559720057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2428559720057109497bkrECE)

here is the doubler plate in place... marking for the cut

http://inlinethumb02.webshots.com/21505/2713442590057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2713442590057109497rEEosR)

here is the 231 with front out put side cut off. I used a regular old sawzall to do this.

http://inlinethumb31.webshots.com/45726/2647816010057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2647816010057109497ZEKbPK)

here is a pic of the block off plate welded to it. I ended up having a local machine shop do it. It cost me 100 bucks, but the guy did a real good job welding it. The block off plate is 3/8 thick.. so if you do this the person doing it needs a rather bic "tig" welder to get good results

http://inlinethumb07.webshots.com/12550/2469043610057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2469043610057109497gPZKCl)

I had some issues with t-case input gears. Long story short I found out that there are 5 different input gears. Which meant I had some work to do.. long story short.. it was a PITA.

[pingpong]

Here the doubler is bolted together. It is clocked almost flat.

http://inlinethumb07.webshots.com/12550/2469043610057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2469043610057109497gPZKCl)

Now the fun starts. I ended up having to cut a huge amount of floor out of the way.

Here the crawl box in place.

http://inlinethumb32.webshots.com/46751/2861727850057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2861727850057109497jwKFFD)

here is a pic of the whole in progress

http://inlinethumb51.webshots.com/47794/2422328010057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2422328010057109497DnyQbI)

Getting it close.. Thank God for my plasma.. and having "spare" empty t-cases around

http://inlinethumb64.webshots.com/18047/2728234470057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2728234470057109497uvvquG)

here is the doubler in place for mock up. I did this so I could measure and have driveshafts redone.

http://inlinethumb15.webshots.com/36558/2854914520057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2854914520057109497Yzcmyy)

Here are the driveshafts shortened and legthened.. Not sure if the front is going to hold up..

http://inlinethumb64.webshots.com/47295/2099780770057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2099780770057109497gijspL)

Here I am tapping the crawl box for a vent...

http://inlinethumb21.webshots.com/45524/2489670090057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2489670090057109497puPnQo)

here the doubler is together for the last time. It has been painted, rtv'd, and lock tighted.

http://inlinethumb37.webshots.com/40484/2703266170057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2703266170057109497RnuXKt)

Here the doubler is in there. This thing weighs about 115lbs. You also need to open up all the holes in the back of the trans. I opened mine up to 5/8's.

http://inlinethumb06.webshots.com/901/2146861560057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2146861560057109497OKYcDo)

On to the last phase of this. Since I had to cut my seat bar, I had to figure out a way to put it back. I called a Eddie at Ground Pounder Fab and had him cut me some flanges. I ended up going with 3 bolt 1/4" flanges.

http://inlinethumb19.webshots.com/38610/2064831430057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2064831430057109497YyhlrT)

Then Woody and I started on building the x-member. The idea was to use a U bend and a straight piece of tubing, and some flanges to make it work. After we got it fabbed up, it had to much flex, so as it stands right now.. it is 3/4 done.

http://inlinethumb56.webshots.com/45239/2396803440057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2396803440057109497fTrljR)

Woody should be finishing up the x-member today, then I can start on remounting my seats. Unfortunately, I cant use my Old PRP seats in my rig due to the way my cage was built:mad:.. moral of that story make sure the seats you use are the ones you want to keep in your rig.

[Mudderoy]

Wow man, interesting but what a lot of work!

[xj4life2]

Looks like it will be a nice set up . I have read alot bout these but have never actualy seen one set up. Thanks for the pics and step by step , let us know how it performs !! We have a guy up here who has a doubler for the 242 to a toy case that I'm thinking of doing I did the math and with stock gears and a 4.7 kit in the yota case man it gets real low !!!

[pingpong]

Wow man, interesting but what a lot of work!

Yeah it is..


Looks like it will be a nice set up . I have read alot bout these but have never actualy seen one set up. Thanks for the pics and step by step , let us know how it performs !! We have a guy up here who has a doubler for the 242 to a toy case that I'm thinking of doing I did the math and with stock gears and a 4.7 kit in the yota case man it gets real low !!!


No problem on the write up.. I am stil a lil ways from being finished. I stil have to fix the floor, and work the shifters out. Plans are to re-use stock shifter for second case, but the front case.. I have to figure something out that is kinda slick. Also Since we are flat skidding the bottom, we are having to totally rework the exhaust. Some of it wil be running inside the cabin area. This is only so I can achieve a true flat bottom.

[XJ4IV]

man I wish I had the time and location to do this... id probably take this on in a buggy but not really wanting to hack up my cherokee

[pingpong]

man I wish I had the time and location to do this... id probably take this on in a buggy but not really wanting to hack up my cherokee



There are less invasive ways of doing what I did. A few companies make range boxes that dont require hacking the floor. A northwest fab Black box (1500 bones) and a flipped d300 is the same length as a stock 231, so no floor hacking required.

If I was to build a buggy.. I would use a 3 spd atlas or stack case... no need to be cheap:D

[drakan1908]

Looks like it will be a nice set up . I have read alot bout these but have never actualy seen one set up. Thanks for the pics and step by step , let us know how it performs !! We have a guy up here who has a doubler for the 242 to a toy case that I'm thinking of doing I did the math and with stock gears and a 4.7 kit in the yota case man it gets real low !!!

Do you have a write up or a link about the 242 doubler? I really like the convenience of the full time so I don't want to lose my 242 by going to a 231 or another tcase. 242s around here are pretty easy to find as people take them out to put in 231s.

[pingpong]

I think the toy case will bolt to an aw4, or an ax15 tans... not sure how the rear part of range case, and second case would bolt together

[pingpong]

Here is a finished pic of the x-member... yeah I painted it pink.. its all about saving the Ta Ta's



http://inlinethumb01.webshots.com/38080/2968121310057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2968121310057109497pfuyZi)



Also got some work done on the exhaust... stil not done though. but it wont be as bad as I thought.

[pingpong]

Looks like it will be a nice set up . I have read alot bout these but have never actualy seen one set up. Thanks for the pics and step by step , let us know how it performs !! We have a guy up here who has a doubler for the 242 to a toy case that I'm thinking of doing I did the math and with stock gears and a 4.7 kit in the yota case man it gets real low !!!


I think the toy case will bolt to an aw4, or an ax15 tans... not sure how the rear part of range case, and second case would bolt together

Talked with one of my Yota's buddy's and he said you need an adapter to run a yota case behind either of the trans... I was almost getting ready to change out my setup for some yota stuff

[4.3LXJ]

Talked with one of my Yota's buddy's and he said you need an adapter to run a yota case behind either of the trans... I was almost getting ready to change out my setup for some yota stuff

I was pretty sure you couldn't bolt up a Yota case with out some kind of adapter. Some of those later Yota cases are chain drive anyway which would gain you nothing. The gear cases need work to be as strong as you would want behind a doubler and running a little more gross vehicle weight. It would be cheaper to change out the chain to the Chevy chain and sprockets which I understand are considerably stronger and are on par with the 241 chain.

[pingpong]

Yeah I if have strength issues, I plan on upgrading to the dodge 231 hd internals (think same as chevy).

[4.3LXJ]

That might be a good idea from the get-go. Remember you are upping the torque by 2.7 on that chain. You would be amazed at how that works. With the ratio I have now, in lowest gear I can't stop with out taking it out of gear. At idle it overpowers the brakes.

[pingpong]

Really dont have the cabbage to do that at the moment... At least not for new parts to do it. I wil give it a try and see what happens...

[pingpong]

Here is a pic of how flat the bottom is.. the pink is the skid/x-member



http://inlinethumb06.webshots.com/44549/2689844170057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2689844170057109497LQjWLj)



here is a pic of how tight it was to run the exhaust over the x-member



http://inlinethumb24.webshots.com/37335/2737870110057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2737870110057109497aMSRPc)



Oh yeah.. did I mention I was adding some rock rails to my ride... I know its a lil late.. but oh well

http://inlinethumb52.webshots.com/35891/2833186690057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2833186690057109497ujouIs)

[4.3LXJ]

Oh yeah.. did I mention I was adding some rock rails to my ride... I know its a lil late.. but oh well


I still don't have any yet. I am waiting for when I do my tube fenders first.

[pingpong]

Thats on my to do list as well. I figure I wil make a template up this week end.. then carry it to the Ground Pounder Fab. where I will have Eddie cut it out of 1/8 I figure 3 bends in some tubing and another card board template... and it whould be good:D we all knows it dont work that way:smiley-laughing021:

[pingpong]

had some major set backs over the weekend. Went and picked up 2 jeeps for resale on Sat morning, figures I would spend a few hrs working on my rig as well.

Went to add fluid.. and the SOB leaked:mad0090: Worked on a few other things on sat.. but got nothing done.

Sunday started the ordeal. Pulled the x-member and t-case. used a whole tube of right stuff sealant on three sealing surfaces. learned a tip that when it comes to clocking rings.. seal the unused bolt holes as well as everything else.


After that was done started to put seats back in.. well of course they wouldnt fit:confused: Was getting ready to start to cut my passenger seat apart, and mod the frame to make it fit, when I remembered I had another set of seats to try. Ends up that Topyota Celica seats are about 4" narrower then the FX ricer seats in the bottom, but the top portion is roomier.:D A lil more mock up and they should be good. DID I mention this is going on while I am working 12 hr shifts this week

[Mudderoy]

had some major set backs over the weekend. Went and picked up 2 jeeps for resale on Sat morning, figures I would spend a few hrs working on my rig as well.

Went to add fluid.. and the SOB leaked:mad0090: Worked on a few other things on sat.. but got nothing done.

Sunday started the ordeal. Pulled the x-member and t-case. used a whole tube of right stuff sealant on three sealing surfaces. learned a tip that when it comes to clocking rings.. seal the unused bolt holes as well as everything else.


After that was done started to put seats back in.. well of course they wouldnt fit:confused: Was getting ready to start to cut my passenger seat apart, and mod the frame to make it fit, when I remembered I had another set of seats to try. Ends up that Topyota Celica seats are about 4" narrower then the FX ricer seats in the bottom, but the top portion is roomier.:D A lil more mock up and they should be good. DID I mention this is going on while I am working 12 hr shifts this week

Sleep is overrated (I wouldn't know this).

[pingpong]

Sleep is overrated (I wouldn't know this).

I know... I have a 16 hr shift on thurs, 8 hr break then another 12 hr shift:thumbdown:


Well at this point I am not taking many pics.... Got the passenger seat mounted in the rig last night. all be it it isnt perfect, but will work, I also got the front header mounted, as well as the wiring for the lights straight. Also got the hood mounted as well, now I just have to drill 2 holes for the hood pins.

I think I am going to try and build a basic bumper this weekend, and might add a grille hoop and stinger if I get around to it.

[4.3LXJ]

Man, you must be younger than me. I used to do stuff like that, but not not. Just the work schedule would do me in.

[pingpong]

Not sure how old you are.. but I am an old 37. Working this kinda shift work does take a toll on you, but I really dont have a choice. I make really good money, and have excellent benefits... at least at the moment.. we just had a contract vote yesterday. I will find out today if we go on strike:patriot::mad:

[4.3LXJ]

60 in a couple of months. I used to work 2 jobs 7 days a week and race too and all that stuff. Just don't have the energy for that now.

[pingpong]

60 in a couple of months. I used to work 2 jobs 7 days a week and race too and all that stuff. Just don't have the energy for that now.


Thats understandable. I get most of my energyu from Monster and 5 hr drinks. They work great, I just wonder what kind of toll they have on me long term.:driving:

[4.3LXJ]

I can drink those, and they work for awhile. But then I get exhausted and then just fall asleep anyway.

[pingpong]

Got some more work done yesterday morning.

I got rid of one problem I had last yr. The damn hood release is gone.. now I have hood pins installed. :D No more stuck hood release to give me issues



Well Since I flat skidded my rig.. the stock t-case linkage wil not work. So luckily I had a set of cable shifters laying around, they arent the prettiest thing, but will serve the purpose, and be reliable.



Will post pics later if I take any today

[pingpong]

Well this part of the Project is done. Got the floor installed, twin sticks mounted, and seats in. I even test drove it. Double low, and first gear is so slow that it doesnt register on my gps:drool: 5th gear in double low... to the floor registers 15mph:smiley-laughing021:

Floor is coming together. Used a lot of an old xj floor, as well as a healthy amount of 16 guage.
http://inlinethumb48.webshots.com/45551/2506897540057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2506897540057109497SfEBGG)

Here I am messing with the placement of the twin sticks
http://inlinethumb53.webshots.com/22068/2973501940057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2973501940057109497vQXdyw)


Here the seats and twin sticks are in place. The celice seat are actually really comfortable
http://inlinethumb46.webshots.com/41645/2569142890057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2569142890057109497gYDdPF)

[4.3LXJ]

When people follow you down a steep grade when you are in the low gears will get angry with you. Their brakes will be white hot when they hit the bottom.

[pingpong]

I did some testing on some trails around the boat yard... 2wd low is awesome.. I have all the control of 4low. just better steering. double low is insanely slow... The flat skid is also awesome. I do have some rattling in the exhasut.. and in the t-case. SO I need to beef up the t-case mount.. and brace the exhaust some.


I am going to add a trans cooler as a steering box cooler.

Over all this swap was worth it, but I think next time I wil just buy a tera low 4 to 1 and call it good.:driving:

[4.3LXJ]

Over all this swap was worth it, but I think next time I wil just buy a tera low 4 to 1 and call it good.:driving:

Another option that would work well is to add a Klune V underdrive in the 4:1 ratio. There are times where 2.7 is a good ratio and others where 4:1 is the way to go too. I have used both and like the choice. I haven't really used the really low gears because I don't have the lockers in yet. But when I do ...

[pingpong]

I played with it a lil yesterday.. it is cool how slow it will go... even better what a lil throttle does to it:D


I have a few things to finish up on it today. I need to change all my fluids... throw some paint on the floor, to disguise the none stock stuff. Might even build a front bumper, and paint it today:D

[pingpong]

Well DIDnt do anything I was suppose to today. I added an AUx cooler for my power steering, and got 3/4 of the way through a front bumper build:D Maybe tommorow I will get around to wiring aux fan, and cb again, as well as get some parts painted

[pingpong]

Just posting some pics of my twin sticks. First pic is of my cases in 2wd

http://inlinethumb49.webshots.com/47216/2737464960057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2737464960057109497GGoEHX)

second pic is of crawl box being in 4lo, and rear case being in 2wd high.. therefore giving me 2wd low

http://inlinethumb52.webshots.com/11571/2591830760057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2591830760057109497cONeic)

if both sticks are to the rear... I am in double low. It is going to take some getting used to using the twin sticks, and picking the right gears in the tranny as well. I can now start my truck in double low, and 5th gear:driving:

[4.3LXJ]

It won't take long to get used to the sticks. It will take more time to get used to the speeds.

[pingpong]

It won't take long to get used to the sticks. It will take more time to get used to the speeds.


Yeah it is different when you can choose so many different things at once. Luckily I have a good spotter for the weekend. We leave tommorw at 5 to go to Winchester Va to the Super Lift even being held at Big Dogs. The guy going with me is wheeling a tracker on toys and 33's:eek::driving::D Should be good times

[xj4life2]

It won't take long to get used to the sticks. It will take more time to get used to the speeds.

Not really you have slow , slower, and check the calander to see when I'll arrive !!! Good luck this weekend !!!

[pingpong]

Talk about a good time... I will post a write up. My doubler survived... front axle didnt fare to wel though:D

[4.3LXJ]

Too much torque to it?

[pingpong]

I broke a chromo stub shaft. I also pigeon toed my steering, and did I mention I cracked a knuckle:shocker: I will post some pics tommorow

[4.3LXJ]

Now you are becoming like the rest of us. J - e - e - p really spells tools and wrench time.

[pingpong]

Damage is worse then I thought.

The tire is pointed in, and cocked sideways a lil

http://inlinethumb24.webshots.com/42647/2706285590057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2706285590057109497WZUcOM)

Here you can see the rotor is not at the same angle of the brakes
http://inlinethumb39.webshots.com/47142/2503481370057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2503481370057109497igFSUg)

Broken stub shaft and part of the unit bearinga and rotor
http://inlinethumb40.webshots.com/42599/2547539270057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2547539270057109497iZZtco)

How the stub broke off
http://inlinethumb29.webshots.com/45596/2465310890057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2465310890057109497svHoSR)

The inner splines twisted too and look like they were about to break
http://inlinethumb07.webshots.com/46214/2898761640057109497S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2898761640057109497wYEAqY)

I also pulled the drivers side.. and it too is broken on the inner shaft:shocker: I guess low gearing and locker makes things go Boom

[Mudderoy]

So these were stock axle shafts? Dana 30? What tire size?

[pingpong]

Those are Alloy Usa 27 spline chromo's for a d30.. and I was running 33x12.5's I was running 12 psi of pressure. The short side inner took is broke in the inner shafts. I might also have rear axle carnage.... I will blow that axle apart tommorow

[4.3LXJ]

I guess that begs the question, how did you do it?

[pingpong]

I competed in a lil rock competition:driving: Long story short High rpm in low low, and catching traction:camera: If you pm me your number I can txt you a short video of the first run I did in the comp.. it was the second run that did me in:headshake:

[4.3LXJ]

That is the thing about the really low gears. There is a tremendous amount of horsepower there. With my own, I figure at idle I have over 500 hp at the wheels. If you double that with high rpms it doesn't take much imagination to see how stuff disintegrates.

[pingpong]

Well I pulled the front end out of my rig... and I am either going d60/14ff or d44/9" I have both sets of axles... and just have to buy gears, lockers to get either set together. Wifey gave me the go ahead to drop the coin too:D

so my post in the for sale forum

[Mudderoy]

Well I pulled the front end out of my rig... and I am either going d60/14ff or d44/9" I have both sets of axles... and just have to buy gears, lockers to get either set together. Wifey gave me the go ahead to drop the coin too:D

so my post in the for sale forum

Too cool. Not knowing anything about it really, I'd like to do D60 front and rear.

[4.3LXJ]

Very nice. Cool wife. I would go with the 9" and D44 for weight and clearance issues over the land anchors

[pingpong]

Right now I think I am going to shorten the HP44 to waggy width, and run a Waggy d44 in the rear. THat would mean I would only have to buy gears and install kits for the HP 44, and chromo's for both axles. I am really Looking at running RCV's or SOme chromo's with 300m joints. Did I mention I was going to run 33 spline shafts front and rear:D

[4.3LXJ]

That will be spendy, but It should work. That would get rid of the coarser splines on the waggy axle shafts. Personally though, I would run some good axles in that 9". It has nodular iron gears which as strong as they get and you can go with 35 spline shafts in it which are also as good as it gets in anything less than 6X6 axles.

[pingpong]

Trying to save a buck here or there on this.. the 9" I have would need a new Center section to run the 35 spline axles, as well as a special locker. Also they are full width axles Waggy width will work nice

[4.3LXJ]

OK. Well I am going to full widths myself. But you are right, if you are going to stay stock width then that is a good route.

[Gabriel J]

Right now I think I am going to shorten the HP44 to waggy width, and run a Waggy d44 in the rear. THat would mean I would only have to buy gears and install kits for the HP 44, and chromo's for both axles. I am really Looking at running RCV's or SOme chromo's with 300m joints. Did I mention I was going to run 33 spline shafts front and rear:D

Why not Support Bobby Long and not the company that really screwed him on his copyright? I know Bobby personally and he is one hell of a guy and does alot for the wheeling community up here in Washington State....:thumbsup:

[LizardRunner]

very cool write up, thank you for sharing this.