Christian wheelers?

[xj4lifetwo]

Although I hate the the term religous, I am a christian and was just wondering how many christian xj owners are on here. As you can see from my signiture I am a member of 4x4him. Its a nationwide christian wheeling club. we are not about preaching and bible thumping , more just good clean family fun and wheeling. Ok back to the original question. Post up if you are or even if your not.

[96xj]

I'm a born again Christian and proud of it ,im not a holy roller as some would put it ,but i do know his word, and i will plant that seed to who ever wants it

[4.3LXJ]

X2 We have talked before on another forum.

[Melissa]

I was born and raised Catholic http://i730.photobucket.com/albums/ww305/melreese83/smilies/jumping0051.gif

[COSXJFAN]

Since you asked, I'm not, but I respect the beliefs of others...:thumbsup:

[TXstiGUY]

I'm with COS to each there own :thumbsup:. I'm atheist and wife's whole family are "down with god big time" that makes for some fun dinner conversations.

[WagoneerCrawler]

I came into this life because of Gods glory, and I intend to keep him in my life. I am a Christian, but in no means am I going to shuv it down your throat. God is love, Sean.

[TXstiGUY]

I came into this life because of Gods glory, and I intend to keep him in my life. I am a Christian, but in no means am I going to shuv it down your throat. God is love, Sean.

I think if more people thought the same way we all do the world would be a better place. freedom of choice its a wonderful thing :patriot:

[4.3LXJ]

That is supposed to be the whole idea, somewhere along the line some people have gotten a different message.

[Mudderoy]

There has never been a time in my life that I didn't believe in God. There's been a few times that I wondered if he really liked me or not. :rotfl2:

I'm an astronomy buff, as well as a physics, and just general science buff, so the more I see the more I am utterly amazed at God's creations.

[4.3LXJ]

Glad you said that, that is the same conclusion many scientists have arrived at also.

[COSXJFAN]

First off, this is a friendly question, and I am by no means trying to start any kind of argument, so here it goes!! If God exists, what culture in our world is right about their religion then?? Meaning, that according to the bible you cannot hold any gods or idols before the "christian" god. So, is the Zulu tribesman that thinks that a weird looking tree is a god destined for hell?? I don't know what a Zulu tribesman holds as his god, but can assure you that it is a completely different god than the christian believers seek. There are too many holes in organized religion, IMHO, for me to believe what they stand for. A look back in time to the way christianity was spread across the land reveals very harsh battles between believers and none believers, bloody damn wars to be quite honest. The crusades were nothing nice, and I think that is one way that christianity was forced upon the common folk. Doing something vile and evil, and writing it off to god's will, I just don't buy it. In closing, I really want to emphasize the point that I mean no offense by this question at all, and feel that it is every man's right to believe in what they choose. Please take no offense in my statements, as they are mine, and I am not asking you to believe or think like I do. I have my reasoning for feeling this way, and that is a long post in and of itself!! Please be open minded about this question, thanks!!

Kyle

[Mudderoy]

First off, this is a friendly question, and I am by no means trying to start any kind of argument, so here it goes!! If God exists, what culture in our world is right about their religion then?? Meaning, that according to the bible you cannot hold any gods or idols before the "christian" god. So, is the Zulu tribesman that thinks that a weird looking tree is a god destined for hell?? I don't know what a Zulu tribesman holds as his god, but can assure you that it is a completely different god than the christian believers seek. There are too many holes in organized religion, IMHO, for me to believe what they stand for. A look back in time to the way christianity was spread across the land reveals very harsh battles between believers and none believers, bloody damn wars to be quite honest. The crusades were nothing nice, and I think that is one way that christianity was forced upon the common folk. Doing something vile and evil, and writing it off to god's will, I just don't buy it. In closing, I really want to emphasize the point that I mean no offense by this question at all, and feel that it is every man's right to believe in what they choose. Please take no offense in my statements, as they are mine, and I am not asking you to believe or think like I do. I have my reasoning for feeling this way, and that is a long post in and of itself!! Please be open minded about this question, thanks!!

Kyle

I think most reasonable people can take a different point of view, as long as it doesn't start out "Jane you ignorant slut!" <--- Original Saturday Night live reference.

Who's religion is right? Personally I think the answer is none. I don't think anyone has it right, because none of the rules are from God's lips. Man has been involved in the writing and interpreting of the "WORD" forever. Religious leaders have twisted "God's word" to gain power, money, etc... I swear, it's enough to turn you off to religion. :smiley-laughing021:

I make jokes, like all time should be Central time zone, because that's God's time. Why? Because I think it's funny and I live in the Central time zone.

I measure religion by what is it's base. Christianity is love. God is love. Hell homosexuals can even love each other, it's just Biblically wrong when their nasty parts touch, but the same is true for non-married heterosexuals.

Basically the problem isn't God, it's man. That will always be the problem. Man twisting things "religious" to better fit his/her ideas of what is right and wrong, or the shades of gray crap.

It's like this rift between the creationists and the evolutionists. So you, as a human, think you are capable to decide what God can and can't do?

I choose to believe in both. You can see a small child running with a stick in his mouth (pointy side in) and you'll stop him (it's almost always a him) and make him take the stick out of his mouth. Why? Are you psychic? No, you just know more and can "SEE" what the probable outcome will be.

God started this universe (perhaps one of many) and he did so with a big bang. He knew what the outcome was going to be. Now maybe there was some poking around as things moved along, but I think he's smart enough just to start the process and sit back and watch.

I know I'm probably going to hell because I think, question and reason, but frankly when the Bible said that God made man in his own image, I think that's what "image" meant. Think, Ask, Reason...

A final thought. If there is no God, no afterlife when I die it will be like before I was born. Nothing. No suffering, no happiness, no boredom. Just nothing. If I believed in God all my life and then I die, I won't even be embarrassed that I was such a fool, I won't be anything.

Now on the other hand I find myself standing in line waiting to be judged by God, I'm going to feel stupid, embarrassed and very very scared.

Luckily I believe in God, but logically I think the best bet is to believe. :thumbsup: :rotfl2:

[4.3LXJ]

First off, this is a friendly question, and I am by no means trying to start any kind of argument, so here it goes!! If God exists, what culture in our world is right about their religion then?? Meaning, that according to the bible you cannot hold any gods or idols before the "christian" god. So, is the Zulu tribesman that thinks that a weird looking tree is a god destined for hell?? I don't know what a Zulu tribesman holds as his god, but can assure you that it is a completely different god than the christian believers seek. There are too many holes in organized religion, IMHO, for me to believe what they stand for. A look back in time to the way christianity was spread across the land reveals very harsh battles between believers and none believers, bloody damn wars to be quite honest. The crusades were nothing nice, and I think that is one way that christianity was forced upon the common folk. Doing something vile and evil, and writing it off to god's will, I just don't buy it. In closing, I really want to emphasize the point that I mean no offense by this question at all, and feel that it is every man's right to believe in what they choose. Please take no offense in my statements, as they are mine, and I am not asking you to believe or think like I do. I have my reasoning for feeling this way, and that is a long post in and of itself!! Please be open minded about this question, thanks!!

Kyle

Kyle

It is true that religion has been the basis of many wars. You cited the crusades, I can give you many more, complete with three examples of complete genocide in Europe. Even the "Boogie Man" was born out of an attempted genocide. That doesn't make it right however. I belie that god has revealed Himself through nature, just as Mudderroy has shared about looking at the stars. If we are going to be truly honest in a quest for knowledge, then we will admit that somewhere along the line, God has been involved. The question of how much is up for grabs I suppose. There are some such as Deists who believe that God just wound up the clock and let it run. On the other end is those who believe in predestination and that everything you think and do is preordained. When I am looking at Scripture, which I believe is inspired, then one thing that runs throughout the book is that mankind has free will. He is allowed to choose his own path. There are many who believe that as you stated that all who do not believe in Christ will be lost. I think there is some evidence that is not true. Let me share something with you. Rom 2 17-29 17Now you, if you call yourself a Jew; if you rely on the law and brag about your relationship to God; 18if you know his will and approve of what is superior because you are instructed by the law; 19if you are convinced that you are a guide for the blind, a light for those who are in the dark, 20an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of infants, because you have in the law the embodiment of knowledge and truth— 21you, then, who teach others, do you not teach yourself? You who preach against stealing, do you steal? 22You who say that people should not commit adultery, do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples? 23You who brag about the law, do you dishonor God by breaking the law? 24As it is written: "God's name is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you."[b]
25Circumcision has value if you observe the law, but if you break the law, you have become as though you had not been circumcised. 26If those who are not circumcised keep the law's requirements, will they not be regarded as though they were circumcised? 27The one who is not circumcised physically and yet obeys the law will condemn you who, even though you have the[c] written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.

28A man is not a Jew if he is only one outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. 29No, a man is a Jew if he is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise is not from men, but from God.

You see, it says here that first it is not OK to do some of the things you have cited. That is what happens when men start making religion some kind of institution that needs to perpetuate itself. Second, even if not part of the recognized church, (Christians were considered Jews for the first 200 years after Christ died), it is what is in your heart that counts. In other words, are you responding to the call of God to live in conformity to a righteous life. This is consistent with freedom of choice. Many believe that God is some type of big brother that will swat you if you get out of line, but that is not the case. You get to choose your path, even if it is not the path God would choose for you.

[COSXJFAN]

First off, I'd really like to thank all of you that posted!! It's very reassuring to know that the members of XJT can have a discussion about a HOT topic, and not let personal opinion get in the way of a level headed, mature conversation/debate!! Hats of to you folks, seriously!! Secondly, I believe in peoples morality, and individual human nature, to be the determining factor in the way they die. At first, this may sound harsh, but hear me out. What I mean by this statement is that when people die, and we all will, what is on your mind at the time of your death, can/will be the deciding factor in if you go into death peacefully. If you have lived a immoral life, full of lies and things that every human knows is wrong, you will die with regret and grief on your heart. This is my impression of hell. When I die, I know that I have made many many bad decisions, but know that those were simply mistakes, human error if you will. I also know in my heart, that I am a good person, and hold myself to a high moral standard. I do this, not because I'm afraid of being judged by God, but so I can have peace in MY own heart, and know that I was more of a help than a burden on those whom I shared this planet with. When I die, I will do so in peace, and that is my definition of heaven.

[BlueXJ]

First off, I'd really like to thank all of you that posted!! It's very reassuring to know that the members of XJT can have a discussion about a HOT topic, and not let personal opinion get in the way of a level headed, mature conversation/debate!! Hats of to you folks, seriously!! Secondly, I believe in peoples morality, and individual human nature, to be the determining factor in the way they die. At first, this may sound harsh, but hear me out. What I mean by this statement is that when people die, and we all will, what is on your mind at the time of your death, can/will be the deciding factor in if you go into death peacefully. If you have lived a immoral life, full of lies and things that every human knows is wrong, you will die with regret and grief on your heart. This is my impression of hell. When I die, I know that I have made many many bad decisions, but know that those were simply mistakes, human error if you will. I also know in my heart, that I am a good person, and hold myself to a high moral standard. I do this, not because I'm afraid of being judged by God, but so I can have peace in MY own heart, and know that I was more of a help than a burden on those whom I shared this planet with. When I die, I will do so in peace, and that is my definition of heaven.

Very well stated. Thank You COS.

[Mudderoy]

First off, I'd really like to thank all of you that posted!! It's very reassuring to know that the members of XJT can have a discussion about a HOT topic, and not let personal opinion get in the way of a level headed, mature conversation/debate!! Hats of to you folks, seriously!! Secondly, I believe in peoples morality, and individual human nature, to be the determining factor in the way they die. At first, this may sound harsh, but hear me out. What I mean by this statement is that when people die, and we all will, what is on your mind at the time of your death, can/will be the deciding factor in if you go into death peacefully. If you have lived a immoral life, full of lies and things that every human knows is wrong, you will die with regret and grief on your heart. This is my impression of hell. When I die, I know that I have made many many bad decisions, but know that those were simply mistakes, human error if you will. I also know in my heart, that I am a good person, and hold myself to a high moral standard. I do this, not because I'm afraid of being judged by God, but so I can have peace in MY own heart, and know that I was more of a help than a burden on those whom I shared this planet with. When I die, I will do so in peace, and that is my definition of heaven.

When you are standing in front of God on judgment day, tell him this. Look back I'll be waving at you and giving you a thumbs up! :rotfl2:

I sure hope we can wheel in Heaven. Who am I kidding, I need to wheel here.

[xj4lifetwo]

I know I'm late posting here even though I started this post , Cos .. I personally respect your views and once had similar ones and well much worse. I started to reply once after your post on the Zulu and the Crusades and stopped. But here goes. To be a Christian is to be Christ like, we are born in his image and need to as Christians imulate his ways. To be a Christian is a choice, plain and simple. I have chosen to accept his ways.To be a Christian is a way of life not just somewhere you go on Sunday mornings. As for the Zulu if he has heard the word and has chosen not to follow Christ and choses the tree then unfortunitly he is doomed. As for the Crusades I believe that although this was done in Gods name it was not his will. As Chritians we have the same choices to make as anyone else and the worldly ways do get the best of us from time to time and we sin , daily. But the great part of it is that we are forgiven. Thanks to all who have posted here for being respectfull and intelegent in thier posts its cool that we can do this.

[Mudderoy]

In an attempt to understand gravity, dark matter, and dark energy Science has been working on several theories. Two are "string" theory and the "Quantum Gravity" theory. I think I'm remembering those names correctly.

Anyway these two camps have been battling it out for years. String theory said there were 10 dimensions, the Quantum folks said 11. The string people came up with 4 theories that explained everything, but that was kind of messy, it should be something simple like E=MC2.

The string people relented and tried it with 11 dimensions and boom, one short equation! Problem is, at least from a religious perspective, it appears that there are many many universes. In which YOU are in most of them. There would be a few where you were never born, and a few where you died, but in the vast majority of infinity you would exist!

Each universe is spawned off anytime someone makes a decision. You were thinking about stopping for that donut this morning but decided not to? Congratulations you created a universe this morning!

Every decision you could make you have made or will make.

So here are the two problems I have from a religious point of view.

If there are an infinite number of you, who has the soul?!?!?!?! If they all do then come judgment day which one of you is judged?

There is at least one universe where you make all the right decisions!

Hang on they are here to give me my medication...

[xj4lifetwo]

Fortunitly the Bible does not agree with those theorys and therefore there is only one of me (appluause) I have only one soul and it belongs to God. Science may prove the exsistance of many different universes and mabey more than one dimention. fortunitly again my God is an infinite God so I'm resting assured he has it all under control

[COSXJFAN]

As for the Zulu if he has heard the word and has chosen not to follow Christ and choses the tree then unfortunitly he is doomed.

I have some points that I'd love to discuss concerning this statement, so here goes!! I disagree, and here is why. Also, this is purely hypothetical, but if what you are saying is true, how is God just? This person, we will call him Zulu for simplification, follows the beliefs passed down for generations of his people, and has no idea the christian god even exists, and how can he?? He does what has been deemed right by his culture, and through no fault of his own, goes to hell!! I find this to be ludicrous. How can he be held responsible for beliefs that he never knew of in any way? That makes no sense what so ever in my mind, and never will. I think that religion was created by man for man, period. They came up with a system of checks and balances, to keep themselves in line, and lead a righteous lifestyle according to the rules and practices of their culture, regardless of their location. It seems to me, they needed closure, a source of comfort if you will, to know that they have lived their lives and their morality to best of their ability!! Again, pointing to my earlier post, and what I feel to be heaven.

[pvt.Tadpol xj]

Hey im scottyadd or i think im called hummer2. H2 for short. Im new on the block. not real learned on a computer. But had to say I have been in his faith for 24 years and still growing.

[xj4lifetwo]

I have some points that I'd love to discuss concerning this statement, so here goes!! I disagree, and here is why. Also, this is purely hypothetical, but if what you are saying is true, how is God just? This person, we will call him Zulu for simplification, follows the beliefs passed down for generations of his people, and has no idea the christian god even exists, and how can he?? He does what has been deemed right by his culture, and through no fault of his own, goes to hell!! I find this to be ludicrous. How can he be held responsible for beliefs that he never knew of in any way? That makes no sense what so ever in my mind, and never will. I think that religion was created by man for man, period. They came up with a system of checks and balances, to keep themselves in line, and lead a righteous lifestyle according to the rules and practices of their culture, regardless of their location. It seems to me, they needed closure, a source of comfort if you will, to know that they have lived their lives and their morality to best of their ability!! Again, pointing to my earlier post, and what I feel to be heaven.

In the hypothetical situation Zulu has never been exposed to the word of God ? I personally feel that he would be considered inocent as a child that dies before being able to make a choice. The Bible refers to it as before we are old enough to sin, but my belef is that if he doesn't know better and has never been givin a chance to hear the word than he (in my opinion) will be treated as a child and be accepted into the Kingdom.

[COSXJFAN]

What about, Islamic, bhuddists, or hindu, etc... Are these tens of millions of people wrong in thier ideology of God?

[Mudderoy]

What about, Islamic, bhuddists, or hindu, etc... Are these tens of millions of people wrong in thier ideology of God?

Yes, but Christians aren't going to go blow them up with a strap on.

Basically if they have heard/read the word of God and choose not to believe they will not be saved. Again it goes back to those shades of gray instead of right and wrong.

[COSXJFAN]

Well, I have to say that I'm impressed with the maturity level here!! This was a great discussion, and I enjoyed it!! I don't plan on changing my beliefs, and by no means intend to change those of you that don't share them. Again I appreciate the open, mature conversation that we had on this topic, thanks much guys!! Take care!!

Kyle

[Mudderoy]

Hey im scottyadd or i think im called hummer2. H2 for short. Im new on the block. not real learned on a computer. But had to say I have been in his faith for 24 years and still growing.

The Hummer (H2) is a joke. It is the same thing as being a newbie here on the board. As you post more that changes, through the hummers, some of the sucky Jeeps, and ultimately to the Cherokee XJ.

[Mudderoy]

Well, I have to say that I'm impressed with the maturity level here!! This was a great discussion, and I enjoyed it!! I don't plan on changing my beliefs, and by no means intend to change those of you that don't share them. Again I appreciate the open, mature conversation that we had on this topic, thanks much guys!! Take care!!

Kyle

Woohoo! We passed guys! :smiley-laughing021:

[4.3LXJ]

In an attempt to understand gravity, dark matter, and dark energy Science has been working on several theories. Two are "string" theory and the "Quantum Gravity" theory. I think I'm remembering those names correctly.

Anyway these two camps have been battling it out for years. String theory said there were 10 dimensions, the Quantum folks said 11. The string people came up with 4 theories that explained everything, but that was kind of messy, it should be something simple like E=MC2.

The string people relented and tried it with 11 dimensions and boom, one short equation! Problem is, at least from a religious perspective, it appears that there are many many universes. In which YOU are in most of them. There would be a few where you were never born, and a few where you died, but in the vast majority of infinity you would exist!

Each universe is spawned off anytime someone makes a decision. You were thinking about stopping for that donut this morning but decided not to? Congratulations you created a universe this morning!

Every decision you could make you have made or will make.

So here are the two problems I have from a religious point of view.

If there are an infinite number of you, who has the soul?!?!?!?! If they all do then come judgment day which one of you is judged?

There is at least one universe where you make all the right decisions!

Hang on they are here to give me my medication...

Whoa. Nice science fiction. That means that each time you make a decision and you span a universe you become a Creator right? And where does all the energy come from to create matter out of nothing? Nice theory, but in my simple scientific mind that creates more problems than it can possibly address.

[xj4lifetwo]

Yes, but Christians aren't going to go blow them up with a strap on.

Basically if they have heard/read the word of God and choose not to believe they will not be saved. Again it goes back to those shades of gray instead of right and wrong.

I agree totally , well put !! Again it goes back to Choice , if they have heard the word of God and denied it then they are doomed.

[Mudderoy]

Whoa. Nice science fiction. That means that each time you make a decision and you span a universe you become a Creator right? And where does all the energy come from to create matter out of nothing? Nice theory, but in my simple scientific mind that creates more problems than it can possibly address.

lol not science fiction, scientific theory.

[TXstiGUY]

I agree totally , well put !! Again it goes back to Choice , if they have heard the word of God and denied it then they are doomed. Or vice versa if your wrong after there religions have quite a few years on yours. Also muslims belive in the same god as you just a different profit.

[4.3LXJ]

lol not science fiction, scientific theory.

:stars:Yes I know, however that one seems out there.:smiley-scared002:

[Mudderoy]

:stars:Yes I know, however that one seems out there.:smiley-scared002:

Very out there, but the more they get into Quantum mechanics the more it looks like wizardry or religion. :smiley-scared002:

[4.3LXJ]

Very out there, but the more they get into Quantum mechanics the more it looks like wizardry or religion. :smiley-scared002:

:thumbsup: Maybe what they really need is another Albert Einstein. Someone who knew the right answers, but couldn't tell you how he got them.

[TXstiGUY]

:thumbsup: Maybe what they really need is another Albert Einstein. Someone who knew the right answers, but couldn't tell you how he got them. Now that sounds like religion :rotfl2: just kiding

[4.3LXJ]

Actually there is reality to that post. I did my graduate work in learning behavior. I happened to read some stuff on Al's learning style, as compared to Picasos. They had great similarities. So the next time you hear the quote "You think you have trouble with math, you should see mine!" He was a brilliant thinker and physicist, but not a very good mathematician. He knew the answers long before he could prove it.

[4.3LXJ]

Very out there, but the more they get into Quantum mechanics the more it looks like wizardry or religion. :smiley-scared002:

:cheerleader: In the field of life sciences, it just keeps getting more and more complicated. The chance that life arose from nothing via random combinations of chemicals keeps getting farther and farther away. I heard one figure that at time was 10 to the 27th, more than all the molecules in the known universe. I just had to accept that one on faith.

There is another one I don't really understand, but in physics and math there is a discipline that uses "knowledge" gained by particles in relation to other particles in an atom. Anyway, this guy claimed there was more "knowledge" between particles in the average human body than that of all knowledge of all the rest of the particles in the known universe due to the complexity of the biochemistry.

Well anyway such stuff can lead you to believe in God because the rational model keeps getting more complex and developing more questions than it can answer.

[DETOURS]

Huh, and here I always thought it was the "JEEP" that brought us all together, why complicate it? :popcorn:

[firehawk]

On the 7th day God created Jeep.....oh and Diet Coke!:thumbsup:

Honestly though, I was brought up in a family that went to church, and I still admire the sunday school teachers I had back then. At the time I believed they taught me alot. I have found in my adult life that this God thing is NOT what I was taught. There apparently are "some" who are the "lucky one's" as far as God is concerned, the rest of us poor smucks are left to struggle thru this life on our own. I COULD REALLY get going on this subject, but I'll leave it there.:)

[dragordie]

I would like to add to this topic. You will and never be alone. Open your eyes and your heart and you will see the blessings that are given to you every day. The door is always in front of you and as said many times in this topic is it is your choice to open that door. I attend Koontz Lake Missionary Church and I am also a member of the mens group on wednesday nights. I have seen what my savior JESUS CHRIST has done in my life. And reserching the fact that he died a horrable death being hung on a cross to forgive our sins becuse we are of human flesh. That was a great price to pay for someone who loves you and I. Lets go back a few years during the colimbine school shootings. That young man ask a 16 year old girl DO YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS CHRIST IS YOUR LORD AND SAVIOR. If she would have said no he might not have killed her BUT SHE STOOD STRONG IN HER FAITH AND WAS KILLED AND SHE KNEW HE WOULD KILL HER IF SHE CLAIMED HER FAITH. Thats real faith. I have taught bible school to teens and the motavation that a teen has when you bring them to Christ is amazing. I dont know anyone or anything that has died for me, other than our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. So with what I have been taught and know makes me a believer in my Lord and Savior. I am going to be 46 this coming January and the drugs and life style that I was living in the late 70s and early 80s there is only one reason why I am still alive today. I personaly have had a lot of CHRISTIANS praying for me to get me this far. But what my Lord and Savior has planned for me only he knows. What I do know is I am to be a diciple and share his likeness and to spread the word of the Lord. I will not push my Faith on no one but if you come to me and ask, I am going to lay it on you HEAVY and we togather will pray. Everyone I pray that you and your friends and family have a Blessed Day.
Dave<><

[jcd302]

I love God! It is some of his "fan-clubs" I wonder about.

If your living like there is no God, I hope your right.

[jdougn]

Although this thread is a bit old, some of you might also be interested in a forum aimed specificially at off-road Christians,
United Christian Off Road Alliance (http://www.ucora.org) I use the same screen name there too.

In addition to their online forums, they organize family friendly trail rides in different regions across the USA and one major event each year. The main event for 2012 is in Moab, Utah.

[xj4life2]

To add to the above post I will add that I am a chapter Leader for the NOR CAL chapter of 4x4him.org . We have chapters all over the country, some use the 4x4him logo and some have had new names but the reality is we are all brothers and sisters in Christ. Check us out if you want to or PM me for more details

[olds-cool]

First off, I am very suprised that this forum has a religion section as most do not. It tends to breed comtempt amongst members. I am also very suprised at how maturely this subject has been handled thus far.
I am now proud to say that I am a Christian. As a child, I went to church with family or friends. Church for a child is filled with the ever repeating Bible stories, you know which ones I'm talking about so no need to mention individuals. There wasn't a whole lot of substance or Bible docterine taught to kids. That left a lot of unanswered questions and as I became a teen, those questions led to me claiming agnosticisim. I believed that there was a possibility of a God but had not seen the proof behind it. I started heading down the wrong path. This continued to slowly get worse. I'd rather not discuss the details of what was going on in my life here on a public forum, but suffice to say it wasn't Gods way. I was at a very low point, suffering from depression, and one step away from filing for a divorce. As I sat on my front step one night having a cig, something clicked. It came to me that all the time I was searching for evidence that God existed, he was giving it to me. I had just chosen to ignore it in my arrogance. I realized what I was doing and where I was headed and I didn't like it. That is the moment that I became a Christian. I had a very personal conversation with God that night. I confessed my problems and sins, told him how thankful I was for what he had given me, and asked for his help to straighten my life out. From that point on, my life has changed tremendously. The lord has blessed me with a great family, a wonderful home, a steady job, and some great friends. I'm also happy to report that 5 years later I am still with my wife and our marriage has never been stronger. She has always been a Christian, and was very understanding of my previous position but still tried to show me the way. I started going to church with her and have been learning a lot. We attend a non-denominational church that is focused on teaching Bible docterine. Our pastor often cites the original Hebrew, cutting out most of the 2000 years of human twisting and shaping (often done for personal gain). Some of those questions from younger years have been answered, some still remain. I have faith that those remaining questions will be answered in time as I become more familiar with His word. I'm still not a perfect Christian, nor will I ever be I'm afraid, but I will continue to place my faith in Him.

I guess I could keep going and address some of the points I've seen posted before me but....
Let's just say that I am happy to be a Christian and glad I can share that with some of you.

[4.3LXJ]

Just a quick word form a moderator here. The reason we can have this part of the forum is that we run the whole site in tolerance mode. All are welcome, regardless of what part of the world you are from and experience level from the Jeeping perspective. We carry this over to the religion section too. That keeps it safe for everyone regardless of religious persuasion. Tony the site owner is a Christian and so am I. So I would like to say that if anyone has questions, regardless of background, that those questions will be answered in the same way, with tolerance. We aim to make this forum a good experience for everyone.

[Mudderoy]

First off, I am very suprised that this forum has a religion section as most do not. It tends to breed comtempt amongst members. I am also very suprised at how maturely this subject has been handled thus far.
I am now proud to say that I am a Christian. As a child, I went to church with family or friends. Church for a child is filled with the ever repeating Bible stories, you know which ones I'm talking about so no need to mention individuals. There wasn't a whole lot of substance or Bible docterine taught to kids. That left a lot of unanswered questions and as I became a teen, those questions led to me claiming agnosticisim. I believed that there was a possibility of a God but had not seen the proof behind it. I started heading down the wrong path. This continued to slowly get worse. I'd rather not discuss the details of what was going on in my life here on a public forum, but suffice to say it wasn't Gods way. I was at a very low point, suffering from depression, and one step away from filing for a divorce. As I sat on my front step one night having a cig, something clicked. It came to me that all the time I was searching for evidence that God existed, he was giving it to me. I had just chosen to ignore it in my arrogance. I realized what I was doing and where I was headed and I didn't like it. That is the moment that I became a Christian. I had a very personal conversation with God that night. I confessed my problems and sins, told him how thankful I was for what he had given me, and asked for his help to straighten my life out. From that point on, my life has changed tremendously. The lord has blessed me with a great family, a wonderful home, a steady job, and some great friends. I'm also happy to report that 5 years later I am still with my wife and our marriage has never been stronger. She has always been a Christian, and was very understanding of my previous position but still tried to show me the way. I started going to church with her and have been learning a lot. We attend a non-denominational church that is focused on teaching Bible docterine. Our pastor often cites the original Hebrew, cutting out most of the 2000 years of human twisting and shaping (often done for personal gain). Some of those questions from younger years have been answered, some still remain. I have faith that those remaining questions will be answered in time as I become more familiar with His word. I'm still not a perfect Christian, nor will I ever be I'm afraid, but I will continue to place my faith in Him.

I guess I could keep going and address some of the points I've seen posted before me but....
Let's just say that I am happy to be a Christian and glad I can share that with some of you.

This is a great post, thank you for taking the time to share it with us.

I am far from a model Christian. I have always believed in God. I have not always believed in man, or men that use God's word for their own gain. The fact that people do this really turned me off to organized religion very early in my life.

Yep, putting up a forum about religion and politics was a risky choice, but I felt that we all were up to the challenge. These subjects are a very real part of our lives and frankly I figured it was silly to try to stay away from the subjects simply because it might cause some contention between members.

The xjtalk staff sets the tone for this site, and as Steve 4.3LXJ has already stated it's one of tolerance. Not for politically correct reasons, but to allow people to talk about things they find important and the chance for the rest of us (I'm really talking about me here) to learn something new.

You really don't learn if you just interact with people that think just like you do.

[olds-cool]

Oh, don't take it as if I had a problem with this section being here. I was just suprised... in a good way.

[xj4life2]

I also believe that tolerance is the key and that some people do use Christianity for personal gain. My thoughts are simple, "organized" religon isn't a bad thing but the most important thing is to have a personal relationship with Christ. BY doing so you find that all the things most find negative will vanish.As a Christian I am far from perfect but I have my savior and know that he is with me guiding my steps so I'm good with that. I am blessed to have Christian friends to help me along the way and to fellowship with.I also think that this section has and will help alot of people through some rough times, without being preached at. God Bless us all !!

[4.3LXJ]

Oh, don't take it as if I had a problem with this section being here. I was just suprised... in a good way.

I didn't take anything yo said in a negative way. I just took an opportunity to express the position of the forum. This is an OK place for Christians to hang out and be recognized as such. We may have some differences on specifics of what we believe, but that is not a bone of contention. On the other hand we have many things that bring us together and that is our strong point.

[Mudderoy]

Oh, don't take it as if I had a problem with this section being here. I was just suprised... in a good way.

I didn't. :D

[LizardRunner]

Guess I'll chime in to this interesting discussion. These are my observations after 47 years of traveling to many different religion's churches for services, going to Jesuit Seminary, and being a spirit walker for my nation; Nakota or Hohe or Assiniboin. First, I have noticed that all the "major" religions share a belief in a creator of all things, exist for the purpose of controlling the followers and desire to smite all who oppose their specific docterine. Second, All these religions seem to state that it is good to take care of all those in need. Third, Each religious sect seems to think they are the one true path, and will argue that point to death, even though they all profess to believe in the same creator of all things. Fourth, I have yet to find any one, man/woman/preacher/priest that can definatively say they know the true words of the creator, without placing any personal thougths within what they say is from the creator. Fifth, those that put on the airs of Knowing the creator are usually the first to break the laws of "G_D" that they so vehemently say all should follow. And I could go on and on and on.

I follow the ways of the creator of all things. I care for all those creatures that are in need. I care not what you say you believe or don't believe, for words are hollow like the rotted log. If you need help, ask and I will give it, without any attachments or expectations. You are my friend, until you show me you are my enemy. If you wrong me, I will forgive your transgression but I will never forget it. I live in the wonder of all things made by the creator, I offer the smoke of cedar and sage, for all those I know, for all those I have never met, for all creatures, and for those who have passed into the spirit world or are soon to be there. I wake with a prayer, give thanks for every meal, and go to sleep with a prayer. I do not expect an easy life, for life is our test before the day of judgement by creator. When I stand before the creator, I want to be able to hold my head high, look into creator's eyes and be judged as one who led the life expected.

[Brasscatz]

I would like to chime in... I am a Christian, and I'm proud of it. I respect all other religions. I had a couple of guys come to my house wanting to talk religion with me. Of course, I was opposed to the idea, because I dislike conflict and I didn't want to be in the position of having to nod my head along with stuff I may not agree with. They asked me the question what I thought happened when we die? I said that I believed in Heaven and the afterlife. I believe in spirits and that we can be visited by them. Apparently, their religion believes that absolutely nothing happens when you die. That you just... cease to exist. After about 3 minutes of us talking, I got them to respect my belief. I told them that I didn't expect them to believe what I do, but to please respect my belief as I respect theirs. That, to me, meant a great deal to me. We all three shook hands, and wished each other well as we parted ways. I felt such a warm feeling after that.

[XJ4IV]

Im a member of UCORA which is a Christian based off roading club
whuc is United Christain Off Road Alliance
UCORA.ORG

[jdougn]

Im a member of UCORA which is a Christian based off roading club
whuc is United Christain Off Road Alliance
UCORA.ORG

Hey that's cool. I wheel with some of the guys that frequent UCORA. I'll probably see you over there too.
Doug

[matchframe]

This is a great thread!!! I am a moderator on the second largest Corvette site on the Internet and there have been some discussions like this but we always ended up having to close the thread or junkyard it because the discussion would get out of control. I see this thread has been here for a couple of years which shows the unique character of this site. Thanks to the Admins and Mods of this site that keep this on track!! I am really glad I found this place!

I am a Christian, grew up in a Christian family. I accepted Christ as my Savior on 15 March 1970 when I was 12 years old. When I was 20 years old, I lost 5 close friends in 5 different freak accidents. I started to wonder when my time was and how it was going to happen. In 1979, I ended up hitch hiking/backpacking through Europe in search of the meaning of life. I found my way to a place in Huemoz, Switzerland called L'Abri. This is a Christian Philosophical school open to everyone who wants to spend the time searching and talking with other people about life. I was there for 3 months and found some answers that I needed and a new direction for my life. Much longer story short, I came back home, went to college and earned my Bachelors of Science in Video Production/Engineering. At first, I worked for Christian organizations, one of which was Second Baptist Church in Houston. I designed and built their Broadcast Video Productions system. I was on their staff for almost 15 years. When I left there, I knew I would not work for a church again, but be a living witness where ever God placed me. I now work at Boeing in Houston as a video tech in support of NASA Operations. I love what I do and would not change a thing.

How I ended up here on XJTalk, my daughter is a student at Baylor and owns a '97 XJ. She was on her way home for Spring Break when she was involved in a multi-vehicle accident. She really had angels watching over her since she had no injuries other than being really sore for a few days from the airbags hitting her. The State Trooper told me she stopped 15 feet from going into head-on traffic. My heart almost stops to think about what could have happened. She asked if I could fix her Jeep which I said I would do my best. That is how I found this place.

So good to be here on this site that has high standards and good character!

[nateyz2000]

Glad I found this one!


Nate
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[modestmar00xj]

I am a Christians, God is Awesome!